What’s wrong with the naive “take successive smallest” procedure in proving well-ordered subsets of $\mathbb R$ are countable

elementary-set-theoryreal numberswell-orders

For context, I have no set theory background and my understanding of sets is naive. I had a discussion with a friend that I thought for any well-ordered subset of the reals, I could simply take the least element, second least, etc. to show it is countable. It is the same procedure described in Is a well-ordered subset of $(\mathbb{R},<)$ countable?. However he told me I had to make use of ordinals (which I don't know about) to index into the set. Is there an intuitive (or at least relatively elementary) reason why I can't count up using my naive procedure to conclude the subset is countable? The main concern I see is about if I ever "finish counting" which I don't know how to reason about and seems subtle.

Best Answer

Given any infinite well-ordered set $X$, you can define an injection $f:\mathbb{N}\to X$ by repeatedly taking the least remaining element as you describe. To be precise, you can recursively define $f(n)$ to be the least element of $X\setminus\{f(m):m<n\}$.

However, this map may not be surjective, and so it may not show that $X$ is countable. For a very simple example, consider $X=\{1\}\cup\{1-1/n:n\in\mathbb{Z}_+\}\subset\mathbb{R}$. This is well-ordered with the usual ordering inherited from $\mathbb{R}$. The least element is $1/2$, then the second least element is $2/3$, then the third least element is $3/4$, and so on. However, repeatedly taking least elements like this does not exhaust all of $X$: the map $f:\mathbb{N}\to X$ hits each element of the form $1-1/n$ but does not hit $1$, so it fails to be surjective.

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