Number Theory – How to Compare Sizes of Extremely Large Numbers

big numbersnumber theory

When numbers get as large as Graham's number, or somewhere around the point where we can't write them as numerical values, how do we compare them?

For example:

$$G>S^{S^{S^{\dots}}}$$

Where $G$ is Graham's number and $S^{S^{S^{\dots}}}$ is $S$ raised to itself $S$ times and $S$ is Skewes number.

It appears obvious (I think) that Graham's number is indeed larger, but how does one go about proving that if both numbers are "so large" that they become hard to compare?

More generally, how do we compare numbers of this general size?

As a much harder problem than the above, imagine a function $G(x,y)$ where $G(64,3)=$ Graham's number. The function $G(x,y)$ is as follows:

$$G(x,y)=y\uparrow^{(G(x-1,y))}y$$

Where $G(0,y)$ is given.

I ask to compare $G(60,S)$ and $G(64,3)$

Best Answer

Basically you want to construct a chain of inequalities that links the smaller expression to the larger expression. Induction is often helpful in these cases.

A useful theorem for Knuth arrows is $(a \uparrow^n b) \uparrow^n c < a \uparrow^n (b+c)$, proven in this paper. It is also proven that $a \uparrow^n c$ is monotonic in $a,n$, and $c$ when $a,c \ge 3$, which is useful as well.

For example, one can easily see that $S < 3 \uparrow\uparrow 6$, so

$$S^{S^{S^\cdots}} = S \uparrow \uparrow S < (3\uparrow\uparrow 6)\uparrow\uparrow(3 \uparrow\uparrow 6) < 3\uparrow\uparrow (6 + 3\uparrow\uparrow 6) < 3 \uparrow\uparrow (3 \uparrow\uparrow 7) < 3 \uparrow\uparrow (3\uparrow\uparrow 3^{3^3}) = 3 \uparrow\uparrow (3\uparrow\uparrow\uparrow 3) = 3\uparrow\uparrow\uparrow 4 < 3\uparrow\uparrow\uparrow (3 \uparrow\uparrow\uparrow 3) = 3\uparrow\uparrow\uparrow\uparrow 3 = G_1$$

To address your harder question, first we need to know what $G(0,y)$ is. Since we need $G(0,3) =4$ so that $G(64,3)$ is Graham's number, I will assume that $G(0,y)=4$.

Theorem: $G(n,S) < G(n+1,3)$

We will prove this by induction. First, observe that $G(0,S) = 4 < 3\uparrow\uparrow\uparrow\uparrow 3 = G(1,3)$.

Observe that for $n \ge 3$,

$$S \uparrow^n S < (3\uparrow\uparrow 6)\uparrow^n (3\uparrow\uparrow 6) < (3\uparrow^n 6)\uparrow^n (3\uparrow\uparrow 6) < 3\uparrow^n (6+3\uparrow\uparrow 6) < 3\uparrow^n (3\uparrow\uparrow\uparrow 3) \le 3\uparrow^n (3\uparrow^n 3) = 3\uparrow^{n+1} 3$$

So if we have $G(n,S) < G(n+1,3)$, then $G(n,S)+1 \le G(n+1,3)$, so

$$G(n+1,S) = S \uparrow^{G(n,S)} S < 3 \uparrow^{G(n,S)+1} 3 \le 3 \uparrow^{G(n+1,3)} 3 = G(n+2,3)$$

and the theorem follows by induction.

So in particular, $G(60,S) < G(61,3) < G(64,3)$.

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